Question: How does everyone here deal with Gargantuan creatures? I'm talking Transcendent C'Tan, Tyranid super bugs, Imperial Super Fortifications. I was at a tourney and I took a completely Farsight Enclave Codex list and I got curb stomped so badly that I was wanting to rename myself Bitch (term for female dog). The C'Tan... he, by himself, took out most of my army. I had 2500 pts and I got stomped BADLY. I just want to learn how to deal with type of crap.
Friends don't let Friends bring the Transcendent. I'm surprised a tournament allowed Superheavies at all...
Snipers and Poison are almost useless against them, and with T9, a 3++ and a shedload of Wounds, you're not going to bring it down quickly. Not to mention that when you do, it explodes and kills everything...
Did you know that a failed Death or Glory still insta gibs Gargantuan Creatures? Tank shock them and hope they don't know that fact. Also, Trancendant C'tan are the ones with the Strength D flamer, right? My command squad survived a full game by hiding on the top of a three story ruin, which templates can't hit.
Sadly, I don't have much experience of actually killing them. All I can really suggest beyond the few situational tricks above is to shoot everything at them and spread out to avoid losing half your army in one turn.
Templates now ignore levels, so that ones out of the running. Transcendents can take a lot of different upgrades that vastly change their capabilities. For example, the one that inflicts a Strength D hit on every model they float over...
The Transcendent C'Tan? Ouch... Shy of matching it with your own Str D, it'd be an uphill fight regardless of what you use.
I'd suggest Broadside / missile drones. Either flavor of XV-88 should work, but the HRR would ignore any armor save it has (don't recall ATM)...
-Kur'os
This C'Tan had both the D template weapon and the barrage weapon... and the upgrade that allows it to shoot both weapons at different targets. The tourney allowed ALL of the frakkers that I mentioned in the OP. I felt so dirty that as soon as I lost my third game I packed my crap and left. I didn't even stay for the after tourney party.
Grav Weapons are ace, if you can get in close enough to make the shot. What's that? You've got T9 3+? My three Grav Centurions will gladly kill you in a turn. (More realistically around 3 wounds in a turn, but meh.)
Barring that, D weapons and Close Combat nasties. Chapter Masters only get S8 but won't die for anything. Wolf Lords are easier to kill by 1/4 but get S10. Assault Terminators. Stuff like that.
I was using a Farsight Enclave roster. Completely codex with no allies or detachments.
What the hell kind of person brought a superheavy not just to a tourny, but to a 2500 game? The real problem seems to be dealing with pricks, not large models.
That said the only superheavies I've had regular contact with are the brass scorpion and baneblades, neither of which are really that frightening.
The type of people who bring those kind of models are the type to "Win at ALL costs!"
Trust me, I was HIGHLY annoyed at the very idea.
I would probably take a couple of Area Denial Nodes. Not exactly expensive and can pump out SD shots with good accuracy. 4 of then can make a lot of no go areas on the table and shred superheavies and GCs out to 6 feet.
Sadly those aren't Tau units.
Pure Farsight Enclaves doesn't fare well in a Superheavy environment, where everything moves fast and shoots hard enough to make it worthless swapping Fire Warriors for Suits anyway...
Area Denial Nodes ARE Tau units. 12 12 12 bunker with a TL Hammerhead Railgun on the roof. If 2 or more hit the same target, the shots become SD. They WERE about 110 points each last I saw them. I used to put 3 Broadsides in them and use them to control the lanes of fire and where enemy tanks would dare to go.
Edit: A quick check shows that they now rock in at just over 170 a pop with 6 Structure points. And the Solid Shot goes all the way out to 180.
Where are you getting this from? I haven't even seen these models before, nor the rules in any of the Tau publications I have...
It's an old unit, but it has been updated.
This blog gives you a run down. Post is a few entries down. http://collectingtau.blogspot.co.uk/
Quote from: The Man They Call Jayne on June 04, 2014, 10:51:42 PM
It's an old unit, but it has been updated.
This blog gives you a run down. Post is a few entries down. http://collectingtau.blogspot.co.uk/
Other than WD#336, is there another place to find the rules for these things? It sounds EXACTLY like what I need to get rid of those darn super nasties!
Other than that, no. But you might be able to find something on a torrent or something. If you were the kind of twisted human being who would stoop to illegal downloads which we fully condemn.
" Area Denial Nodes are connected to each other and can combine their shots to increase the effect. Declare that you will shoot with two or more Area Denial Nodes a Coordinated Shooting before announcing the hit-rolls and select a target. Only Solid shots can be made. Now make your hit-rolls. If two or more Area Denial Nodes score a hit then those Area Denial Nodes get the special rule "Titan Killer"."
It's a translation from the French. But this ability is basically the entire point of the unit. So you choose to coordinate fire with 3 ADNs, you get 2 hits, those 2 hits are now Strength D. I used to run 4 of these things back when they cost less. But in Apoc I would still run 4 now. it would set you back about 650 points for all 4, but you can put Broadsides in them for extra shots.
EDIT: Scratch that, I think they are in the 2013 Apoc book.
I wouldn't count on being able to fit Velocity Trackers and newer gear though.
I actually EBay'd the above mentioned WD some time ago to get the ADN. A great unit in my opinion, but trickly to size appropriately...
Otherwise, I believe they have 6 hull points, not structure points. The "tripling" mentioned is likely referencing the SP to HP ratio that was introduced a while back...
Unfortunately, to get any milage out of the ADN's point attack rule, you'd have to play an 'unbound' list. The ADN is at is a single super-heavy and would therefore take up the single Lord of War slot allotted (unless you run a double / triple org list, but that'd be more complicated that anything).
An unbound list would be able to accommodate the 2+ ADNs required to get the Str D hits. And, with a lucky roll, a single Str D can drop a Trancentdant C'Tan. >:]
Would have been great to see this as a new kit or at least referenced in Stonghold Assault... T-T
-Kur'os
Hmmmm, that's a pretty old unit. I'd probably be fine in casual games, but I'd need the WD in hand for some concrete proof.
Quote from: Kur'os on June 05, 2014, 05:42:45 AMUnfortunately, to get any milage out of the ADN's point attack rule, you'd have to play an 'unbound' list. The ADN is at is a single super-heavy and would therefore take up the single Lord of War slot allotted (unless you run a double / triple org list, but that'd be more complicated that anything).
An unbound list would be able to accommodate the 2+ ADNs required to get the Str D hits. And, with a lucky roll, a single Str D can drop a Trancentdant C'Tan. >:]
Considering that I don't want to spend a bajillion dollars for a Tigershark or, God Forbid, a Manta. I would spend the points in a heartbeat because I need to be able to get rid of cheating ass crap like a transcendent C'Tan and Wall of Martyrs.
Remember that D Weapons don't ignore Invulns except on a 6 now. The C'Tan will be laughing your shots off on a 3+ most of the time...
But you also do Multiple wounds per hit don't you? D3 or D6 or something? only 1 or 2 shots need to get through.
You'll get two turns of fire maximum before it wrecks the ADNs, though. :/
Quote from: CoffeeGrunt on June 06, 2014, 07:42:25 AMRemember that D Weapons don't ignore Invulns except on a 6 now. The C'Tan will be laughing your shots off on a 3+ most of the time...
Math Hammer is on my side with this one. I would make him make so many saves that he'll pop.
Remember that as Superheavies these explode massively, and will be in your deployment zone.
Quote from: The Man They Call Jayne on June 06, 2014, 11:56:27 AM
But you also do Multiple wounds per hit don't you? D3 or D6 or something? only 1 or 2 shots need to get through.
Yes, multiple automatic wounds. His high toughness is moot. The kicker is, once you hit with your Str D shots. You roll on the damage chart. A 6 equals 6 + D6 wounds with no saves of any kind.
Should equal a dead C'Tan...
-Kur'os